Victor: Do you listen to all the experts on podcasts and think, "no wonder they're experts. They're awesome. They're smart. They're..." -- stop right there! You're awesome. You have a story to tell, and there really is no one like you. Fellow normal humans Dalia Ramahi and Jordan Drayer share what they've learned in hopes of inspiring you to find your unique voice. This is the Blooming Voices Podcast. Go to bloomingvoices.com for more information. Now let's get to it.

Dalia: Hi guys. Welcome to another episode. I'm Dalia Ramahi. 

Jordan: I'm Jordan Dreyer. And today I'm going to read some things to Dalia to get her thoughts. And we'll talk about twins. We're going to talk about us being twins. And I know lots of people have questions all the time because this is how it was growing up. Well, definitely for me. What about you? 

Dalia: Oh, definitely, all the questions. 

Jordan: So this book is called New Understandings of Twin Relationships, from Harmony to Estrangement and Loneliness, from Dr. Barbara Klein, Stephen A. Hart, and Jacqueline M. Martinez. This is an interesting section that I found as I was reading last night, "Singleton Anti-Twin Discrimination." So this means what singleton, normal birth people, think of twins, the bad things people can think of twins. 

Dalia: The normal birthers, interesting, okay. 

Jordan: So they have, they have nine things. This comes from various research and there's nine different points. Hopefully you don't feel these ways, but this is what they've found. So normal birth, singleton people might think, one, twins are abnormally different from them or an indivisible binary unit, rather than seeing them as two individuals, two de-individualized, identical clones within the pair, abnormally immeshed humans, humans enjoying a special, magical co-twin bond, people possessing special abilities, persons requiring constant comparison, individuals requiring birth order identification, and de-humanized lab rat participants in experiments.

Dalia: Oh my God!

Jordan: What do you think of the first one, abnormally different from them? 

Dalia: You mean like, what do I think -- if I ever felt that way or other people felt that way about me?

Jordan: Or do you -- do you -- have you ever had some normal birth person think that or say to you, like, "you must be odd, you must be different." I don't know.

Dalia: All the time! Um, but you know, what's funny is that my sister and I forget that we're twins sometimes.

Jordan: Me too, me too.

Dalia: So I have my own identity and she has her own identity. So when we go walking in public or whatever -- I'm talking about pre COVID days when we had, uh, no masks on, you know?

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: People would stare at us and it would be like the oddest looks, and we do have similar styles, so sometimes we dressed very similarly. So I would look at her and like, "oh my God, everyone's staring at me. I must look damn good today from getting all these stares," and we just start laughing. But you know, it'd take us a minute to realize that I think people are staring at us because we're twins, you know?

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: And as common as twins are, apparently it's really not that common for people to see on a regular basis.

Jordan: Yeah, it's still not that common and -- well, because there was one time we were at a flea market, and this guy followed us like two blocks worth just to say "you're twins!" or something like that. And it's like, wow, because we noticed him following behind us. And then he finally like got in front of us and was like, "you're twins?" It's like, yeah. Okay. You followed us all this way just to say that? Good for you. 

Dalia: Yeah. One time we were at a Target literally, and just this, about this abnormal thing, this guy -- and we were in the, you know, the greeting card aisle -- and this guy comes up to my sister and I very vulgar or, you know what I mean? And he looks at, he's like, "oh my God, you're twins? Look at you, both of you with the really, uh, big booties," but he used other language, more colorful language to describe it. And like, "even those are the same!" And I'm like, oh my God. Like I was so I was disgusted because I, I really hate that kind of --

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: -- behavior. It was so gross, but it just goes to show you that people really think like, it's, they, they do treat you like it's the most abnormal thing. So I get it. So I kind of get that, but.

Jordan: Yeah. What about an indivisible binary unit? This one, I can -- there were times in high school -- like luckily, because I went to a different college from my sister, so that's when my life, as a single person started to take off. But like in high school, if somebody saw me, they'd be like, "Hey Jordan, where's your sister?" Like for some reason, I'm not allowed --

Dalia: Yeah.

Jordan: -- to be not without her. I mean to be without her.

Dalia: It's forbidden for you to be apart from your twin sister at all times. 

Jordan: I know! Like for me to be in a different class or something.

Dalia: Ah, we get that too. I mean, for God's sake, people call us Ramahi or people call us Dana-Dalia or D and D because they think of us as one unit, you know, or the twins.

Jordan: Yeah. Like I -- there were definitely people that said stuff like, "Hey, Drayer! If I just say Drayer, I'll be right 50% of the time!" or something like that. 

Dalia: Yeah, exactly.

Jordan: It's like, okay, well, thanks.

Dalia: You know, I always, I have to say that, you know, um, and it, you know, how earlier we were talking about taking things personally? I used to take that very personally because my sister and I see ourselves, like I just said earlier, as two different people. We're individuals. 

Jordan: Yeah! 

Dalia: And so when someone doesn't take the time to get to know me versus my sister and think it's just easier for them to call us Ramahi or twins, for me, it always showed a lack of care. 

Jordan: Yeah!

Dalia: A lack of wanting to get to know you as you.

Jordan: Yeah, me and Kendyl were kind of cruel in middle school to people. They'd, they'd be like, "Hey, uh, Kendyl, can you, um, do this?" And I'd be, I'd yell across the room, "Hey, Kendyl, she wants you to do this for her!" And like, "can she use your scissors?" 

Dalia: Oh my God.

Jordan: 'Cause I wanted, I was just feeling mean and petty. And like, it's like, you got me wrong for the third time. 

Dalia: Yeah. What's the, what's the next one?

Jordan: Two de-individualized identical clones within the twin pair. 

Dalia: I'm not really sure I understand that one. 

Jordan: So it means two clones, like people that have exact same personality. 

Dalia: Oh, oh yeah. Like clone copies of each other. Like you'd literally just carbon copies.

Jordan: Yeah, that you eat everything that she eats and, and yeah, me and Kendyl have a lot of the same tastes like, uh, I don't know, sushi --

Dalia: But so do husband and wives!

Jordan: And normal brothers and sisters. I like crunchy peanut butter and she likes creamy peanut butter. She loves Brussels sprouts. I can't stand them. 

Dalia: Yeah. My sister likes Dr. Pepper. I like Coke. Ha. Just kidding. But it's I, yeah, but it's uh, I do have something to say about this, that growing up, we always got the same, exact thing, no matter what it was, because it was assumed that we liked exactly the same thing.

Jordan: Oh yeah.

Dalia: From clothes to food, to candy, to toys, to whatever it was, people never deviated. If they got my sister, one thing they made sure to get me the same exact thing, because they're like, "you're twins. We can't treat you differently. We have to get you the same exact thing."

Jordan: Did, did your parents do that too? Or just other relatives?

Dalia: Mostly other relatives. My parents, for the most part, they, they, um, they absolutely know the difference between my sister and I, and so, and they know our personalities as well. But that being said, whenever it came to celebrating one of us, they also celebrated the other, because they didn't want the other one to feel bad. Like for example, if one made the Dean's list or one made the Honor Roll, or whatever accomplishment one twin made, it wasn't just about me or her. It had to be both of us because they were -- they always assumed or, or just made the connection that, you know, if one doesn't get what the other one has, she's gonna feel devastated. 

Jordan: Yeah. 

Dalia: They have to be treated exactly the same. That's not true. 

Jordan: Yeah. Like that would happen for us too. Our parents, well, they always, yeah, they definitely did a good job of knowing us and giving us different things and different clothes, but it was always the relatives that sent the same things and the same clothes. The same color. 

Dalia: Yeah. I don't know. I don't think this was on your list, but one thing I just want to add is that I feel like that, uh, other people, singletons -- or what was the word you used?

Jordan: Yeah, singletons.

Dalia: Singletons. Yeah. They assume twins have this fragility to them that, that isn't really there. Like somehow I can't function without my sister. And it goes back to what you said earlier, like when you can't go out without your twin or something like that, they just, and so they, I don't know. 

Jordan: I think that that actually fits the next item on the list. Abnormally immeshed humans. 

Dalia: Ah, okay, good, good.

Jordan: And yeah, I, I do think so too, where people are like, "well, I don't know, if I spend more time with Jordan than her sister, I don't" --

Dalia: Yeah. It's almost impossible to feel like you have your own friends when you're together. 

Jordan: Yeah. I still honestly believe -- because the both of us tried out for drum major in high school, and it's still my true belief that the band director didn't pick either of us for any of the three drum major positions or the field commander positions because she didn't want to make a choice over one or the other of us. 'Cause we, there was like 10 kids trying out. And I know that I was one of the stronger candidates, but neither of us were chosen. And I --

Dalia: And you know, that's probably true, because people don't want to feel like they're picking sides when it comes to twins. 

Jordan: Well, she, yeah --

Dalia: Oh my God.

Jordan: -- also -- she knew. The teacher, she knew she were -- that we were somewhat like, you know, depressive teenagers and stuff. So...

Dalia: Oh really?

Jordan: Like, she was probably --

Dalia: But again, it goes to that fragility. They think that, that they got to treat us with kid gloves almost. Picking teams as a classic example when you're on the playground at recess or whatever, and you pick teams. Oh my God, people would have such a hard time picking between me and Dana because they're like, "oh, if I pick one, it may -- the other one might think I don't want her on my team" or whatever it was, you know? People over-thought it way too much.

Jordan: Well, well, so you, you went to a really small school, right? There's only like one class of kids per grade? 

Dalia: Pretty much. Yeah. 

Jordan: Okay. 'Cause I, I was able -- and it's funny too. 'Cause my mom said when she first had us in the hospital, the doctor that delivered us was like, make sure that they're in separated classes. 'Cause he was like, if I give you one piece of advice, it's this. And so she did, like, we were only together in kindergarten, and then we were always separated. So actually that picking teams was never a problem for me. 

Dalia: Oh really? Yeah. I, I went to public school up until uh, through second grade, and we were always in separate classrooms.

Jordan: Oh, okay.

Dalia: And then when we were in third grade, we went to a private school, and it was a much smaller school and they put us in the same classroom. And after that first year, they saw that our grades were really mimicking each other too much. So they said, I think it's time to put them in separate classrooms. So when we got to fifth grade, we finally went into separate classrooms, and academically you can see the differences between us. But then when we got into junior high, which, um, where I live, is seventh grade, they just lumped us back into the same classroom. So at that crucial time, you know, when you're an adolescent going through becoming a teenager, our identities seem to merge with everybody in our classroom again. Do you know what I mean?

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: So it definitely, I think, affected us deeply and made us want to really try to stand out as individuals. And, and it's like, we were always fighting against something, you know? 

Jordan: Yeah. So the next one is humans enjoying a magical bond. 

Dalia: Oh, that sounds really magical. Tell me about that. Tell me about that. 

Jordan: Well, so did you ever get these questions? Do you have ESP? Can you feel her pain? When, when she's in pain, do you feel her pain? 

Dalia: We still get those questions. It's ridiculous! We tell people, yeah. Yeah, absolutely. We, we both know what you're thinking too.

Jordan: Yeah, that's a good one. I never thought about responding in that way. I guess 'cause I'm not with my twin as much anymore, like I don't get the questions any, any much more, but yeah, definitely in high school and college. No, I don't feel what she feels. There was one time when she was like being punished where I imagined her pain and that made me like cry as much as she was crying because I could hear her crying. And I don't know. I do know it's true that twins are more em -- empathic than other people. So it might come from that. But I can also feel the pain from, uh, the closed captioning stories that I used to do of people that have lost a son or whatever, that kind of thing. 

Dalia: Yeah. That's, that's what, that's what empathy is. And um, you also know your twin better than anyone else. So you are also able to understand how she might react to something more and feel with her, you know? 

Jordan: Yeah. 

Dalia: That said though, there is something magical and I don't know if you and Kendyl have ever experienced this. It's not like ESP, but there are times where if my sister and I will be hanging out, we're both quiet doing whatever it is. And then I will say, I will say half a sentence out loud. Like I might accidentally finish my thought out loud, and she'll know exactly what I'm talking about and agree with it or just respond to it. And then we look at each other and realize what just happened. We're like, oh my God. But I think again, that has more to do with just being around somebody so much, you know them. And so you understand their thought processes not some magical connection, you know what I mean?

Jordan: Yeah. I actually, there was some study done on pairs of twins and then husbands and wives that have been together for at least 20 years, where they had to solve a puzzle or something. And the husbands and wives did really well, as well as the twins basically. So it really just comes from shared memory because you grow up with, you know, like your brothers and sisters, you have shared memories, you know them really well. 

Dalia: That's really cool. Okay. So I'm really liking these. Okay. What else you got? 

Jordan: Well, so the next one is a special abilities, but I believe that just falls under the magic one. We kind of already covered that. 

Dalia: Yeah.

Jordan: Okay. So the next one is persons requiring constant comparison. I know I can definitely, um, like, uh, relate to this one, and it can be interesting, you know, like from my own, because I like to see cool things too. Like when my sister and I took the FCAT, the Florida assessment test thing, it was always so interesting every year to see our grades mirrored each other's. Like, she was stronger in math and I was stronger in reading. But other than that, people are always like, you know, who's born first, who's faster, who's taller, who weighs more? Who has better grades?

Dalia: Yep.

Jordan: Like, do you do that with other brothers and sisters? No, not really. 

Dalia: Yeah. I mean, I, I never see that happen with other siblings unless they're so close in age. They're like, what do you call them? Irish twins or whatever. 

Jordan: Yeah, Irish twins.

Dalia: Like in that case, I have, I do know a few that have been compared as if they were twins, you know? But for the most part, I feel like it's such a uniquely twin or maybe even triplet thing, you know? Uh, my sister and I all the time -- "Oh, you're the funnier one. You're the more serious one. You're the, um, you're the more athletic one, and you're the more artsy fartsy one," whatever. I don't know. 

Jordan: Or the one that always comes up is, "who's the more outgoing one? Who's the more shy one?" 

Dalia: Yes! That's like, I don't know why people are obsessed with that -- and then, you know, what I realized is I think it makes them feel better about themselves to be able to classify us, because to them, it makes sense. You know, I read something once about people needing to, um, put things in like hierarchical order. 

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: They need hierarchy. They need to, um, have sequential events or, or things need to be ordered in their mind. And I think that if they see two, if they see two people, like I'm talking about twins, they need to make sense out of them. And so one has to be different from the other somehow or compared. They need to compare the two to find what is more and what is less in each of them. Do you know what I mean? 

Jordan: Yeah, that more or less thing is kind of what's a in -- and I understand the need to be able to tell us apart. Yeah. 'Cause like I meet other twins. I am blown away how identical they are and yeah. It might be helpful to you to be like, okay, so she's the one that likes art more, uh, she's the one that usually wears blue. And so that could help, but like comparing and seeing like more or less like, oh, she's faster. Like she's, I mean, she's better, you know?

Dalia: Or the one like, oh, she's fatter, and she's thinner. Like I hate --

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: -- oh my God! 

Jordan: Yeah, I know.

Dalia: -- listeners out there or the non twins, if you really want to be able to tell the difference between us twinsies, just get to know us individually. And it will become really easy, I promise. 

Jordan: Yeah. And we're probably not going to play tricks on you. 

Dalia: Yeah.

Jordan: 'Cause people are always like, well, what if I go out on a date with your sister and then it's actually you? It's like, no, because why would I do that? I'm not gonna --

Dalia: -- fantasy. Let's face it. That's just, that's just a wishful fantasy that people have. And it's weird. Okay? 

Jordan: I don't want to live her life. Like people would always say, do you ever take tests for her? And it's like, no! Because I don't want to -- what if I mess up a grade for her? And, or like --

Dalia: We're not gonna sabotage each other's lives. 

Jordan: Yeah, I don't want to do that. And like she took Latin and I took French. I'm not going to sit in for her classes all day. 'Cause I couldn't take a Latin test for her, or I don't know how she acts in class. 

Dalia: Oh my God, the cheesiest joke that we always get, ugh! especially, um, when I was in the corporate world, okay? And you know, sometimes I'd bring my sister over for my coworkers to meet or to come hang out or visit whatever, you know? And people'd be like, ha ha ha ha, how do we know that you didn't switch places and it's not really Dana sitting here doing the work? And it's just like, yes, my sister's going to leave her job to come and do my job while I go goof off. So I mean --

Jordan: Yeah, like --

Dalia: -- I can take a joke, people think it's funny, but it's just so -- I honestly, I find it so cringy, and I'm not trying to be mean, but like, 'cause I think we hear it so much that it's just old. 

Jordan: Yeah. It just makes it seem like the fact that you exist is to make them amused. And it's like, no, my twin has her own life. Why would she -- yeah, exactly. Why would she leave my -- why would she leave her job, lose money at her job just to come pretend to be me for a day?

Dalia: And you know, this is, this is getting a little personal. Um, and it's, and it's not meant to be interpreted any weird way, but I know, I don't know about you guys, but or if any other twins experience this, but people feel they, they have the right to less boundaries with us. Um...

Jordan: Yeah. 

Dalia: Whether it's invading our physical, personal space by, by touching us or, um, getting really personal about information because they think it's their right to know, because they're not twins and they just want to understand or whatever. And honestly, that's something that I know my sister and I struggled with and is a huge part of the way, of the, of the reason why we are the way that we are today, which is fiercely outspoken, fiercely independent, but supportive of each other. But when it comes to other people, we kind of, um, had this approach where, uh, we keep someone at an arm's length because of all the invasiveness. I don't even know if the word, that's the correct word, but do you know where I'm going? 

Jordan: Yeah, I do. And actually it makes me think of what I, I, 'cause I am not, but I, what I've read of transgender people and their fight and people asking them these really personal questions. Well, so what is it like when you go to bathroom or something like that? Just these stupidly personal questions. It's like, I understand the curiosity. Yes. I really do. But remember you're actually talking to a person too, and like you need to give them their dignity still. It's just another person, another human. 

Dalia: Absolutely. Yeah. So I mean that whole like autonomy and boundaries is something that growing up, we've struggled with, and as, um, you know, grown women, uh, we are able to clearly identify with other people. So I think that's one of the bigger challenges of being a twin is that lack of boundaries that people think they have a right to when it comes to us as twins. 

Jordan: Yeah. And like, I don't want to say that there's nothing always wrong with comparisons because yes, it is interesting. And you, I mean, people compare -- I mean, I suppose parents compare their children being like, well, this is my more artistic daughter, and this is my more sporty daughter or something like that. But using comparisons as facts like that and not, oh, well, she's artsy, so that means I don't like her, you know, this kind of thing. 

Dalia: Yeah. That means she's better in math. So that means naturally she must suck in math or whatever it is. Come matter of fact. Exactly. Yeah. Comparisons are fun. We all do it. It's, it's normal. I think there's a time and place for it though. 

Jordan: Yeah. So the other one was about birth order identification, but that's part of that same thing, just comparing who's older --

Dalia: Oh yeah --

Jordan: -- and kind of thing. Like everyone really always -- it was something actually when we were little, like five, four years old and people asked us, we'd be like, we're the same age! 'Cause we were, we were too young to understand this concept of somebody had to come out first. 

Dalia: Exactly. Um, that's why like I, when I joke with the people that are like, "oh, who's older or like how far apart?" I'm like, "I'm the baby of the family. I'm the youngest." And my sister will look at me like, "uh-huh. I'm a baby too. I'm the baby too," like we're both the youngest. You know what I mean? But --

Jordan: Yeah.

Dalia: -- it's just being silly, but yeah. 

Jordan: Yeah. And anyway, I mean, I read conflicting things about birth order stuff. Like, is it a good psychology? Is it not a good psychology? 

Dalia: I don't really know too much about it. Tell me something.

Jordan: Just some people, I guess there's, there's some research that says where you're born in the family leads to what kind of personality you might have. 

Dalia: Oh, got it.

Jordan: Like first children tend to be more organized and uh, better leaders and stuff like that, while baby of the family tend to be better comedians or this kind of thing. 

Dalia: Well, there might be some truth to that because I am fun-ny! No, I'm just kidding. 

Jordan: So is my brother, and so I believe there's some truth to it, but then I read conflicting things where they're like birth order stuff is crap and whatever. Just like every other theory, like, I mean, you can only prove your point or not prove your point. Like you just keep finding more information and more evidence.

Dalia: Goes back to the idea of needing to label things. 

Jordan: Yeah. The last one is de-humanized lab rat people and experiments. 

Dalia: Tell me about that one. 

Jordan: I do think it's cool to do twin studies just because I like science and stuff like that. When people do those kinds of things, like one twin is in one room and the other twin's in the other room and it's like, okay, when they see a triangle, what's the first color they think of, this kind of thing. And so those are kind of cool, but I suppose you can take it too far if, if you, if, -- 'cause they're saying de-humanized. 

Dalia: I mean, I've never been de-humanized and actually my, my sister and I, we were part of a twin study growing up for our whole childhood.

Jordan: Oh cool. 

Dalia: We had this lady. I don't know the specifics. I can't remember how we became part of it. I'm sure my mom agreed to it so long ago when we first came to this country or whatever it was, you know? Uh, but ever since we were little from like, I want to say kindergarten, first or first grade up until high school -- yeah, we graduated high school -- we were part of this twin study or experiment. And when we were little, I remember this lady asking us questions, blah, blah, blah. I don't remember the exact nature of the questions, but it wasn't, it didn't, it wasn't very invasive.

I, from what I remember, I never was like uncomfortable. There's just like a little bit of time. 'Cause we were little kids. Over the years that stopped. And as we got older from time to time, we'd have to fill out these questionnaires or um, whatever. And every year on our birthday, I must've forgotten at some point, because every year on our birthday, we'd get these, this birthday card, one for me, one for my sister, from these people that we never knew. I'm like, who are these people? And I think also my mom at one point forgot about it too. You know what I mean? So it's really, I don't know. I don't know. 

And then, uh, when we graduated high school, we got this like graduation card or something, and my mom's like, oh, that's right. You guys were part of a twin study. And from time to time, like, you know, she'd get these documents or whatever. Like she'd have to do some, we stopped doing things. But then, um, when we were in college, we got a, a letter in the mail that said that the twin study that they'd been working on was finally being published or it was concluding or whatever. And they thanked us for our participation and we're like, wow. Talk about a long, the twin study. 

Jordan: Yeah. 

Dalia: You know what I mean?

Jordan: That's, that's really -- I mean, that's not dehumanizing, the fact that they sent you birthday cards and stuff. 

Dalia: Yeah, exactly.

Jordan: 'Cause they remembered that you're real people. So I'm not sure exactly. I'll have to read more in this chapter. I was just reading you the bullet points that are the heading of this chapter. 

Dalia: Yeah. 

Jordan: Uh, but I mean, I guess I can see that people, like a scientist just asking for twins, any twins and, and just seeing them as subjects that, you know, and not getting to know them. But when you're a scientist and you've got stuff to go through it, I mean, I can understand not taking the time to get to know your subject either, even if they were not twins.

Dalia: And I think it was really important that, in our twin study, they made it a point to send each of us a card.

Jordan: Oh, that's nice. Yeah. 

Dalia: 'Cause normally when -- if people send birthday cards or whatever, back to that other point, they would send one for the most of both of us, or maybe one present for the both of us to share. But the fact that the study actually took the time to identify me from my sister, and you know what I mean, um, was pretty cool. 

Jordan: Okay. So yeah, I think that's a good start on twin questions, and we'll probably bring up twin stuff again in another episode. 

Dalia: This was fun. Very interesting. Yeah. 

Jordan: Yeah. Some twin questions answered and just treat twins like normal sisters and brothers. That's basically the takeaway. 

Dalia: Yeah, exactly. 

Jordan: They're not freaks. They don't have a special bond. It's just shared memories is all and -- although one thing I will say -- I was, I forgot to mention earlier -- my mom always has this experience where she's in the kitchen. One of us comes in and says something like, "the light needs to be fixed," and then leaves. And then the other one comes in five minutes later, that same tone of voice, like "the light needs to be fixed." And so that's like, I wouldn't call that ESP or anything. It's just similar brain patterns that, uh, okay. I noticed, I observed the light is out. And then we have similar voices, like in our, you know, the, whatever diction we've learned, or we happen to speak in a similar pattern.

Dalia: Undeniable, like we can't forget, yes. We want to focus the fact that we're individuals. But at the end of the day, we have a bond that's stronger than a regular brother, sister bond or siblings because we were born together, and we share some aspects of us more closely than a regular brother or sister, sister and sister would. So that would -- it's normal that maybe those kinds of things still happen. And yeah, that's, uh, I think those are twin things. But for the other stuff, we're two different people. 

Jordan: Yeah. So we'll leave it there.

Dalia: Yep.

Jordan: And thank you for joining us again.

Dalia: Yeah. Thanks guys. And if you have any questions or comments, feel free to hit us up. And if you have your own twin story or a twin story to share, please feel free to share it with us. 

Jordan: Yes. Thank you very much. We'll see you next time. 

Dalia: See you next time. 

Jordan: Bye.

Victor: That's our show. Didn't get enough of the twins? Go to BloomingVoices.com for more information and let us know what you thought of the episode. Twitter, Instagram, email, we've got the works. We'll see you next Wednesday.