Victor: Do you listen to all the experts on podcasts and think, "no wonder they're experts. They're awesome. They're smart. They're..." -- stop right there! You're awesome. You have a story to tell, and there really is no one like you. Fellow normal humans Dalia Ramahi and Jordan Drayer share what they've learned in hopes of inspiring you to find your unique voice. This is the Blooming Voices Podcast. Go to bloomingvoices.com for more information. Now let's get to it.
Dalia: Hi everybody. Welcome to another episode of Blooming Voices. We are so excited to have you here. I'm your host, Dahlia Ramahi, along with...
Jordan: The other host, Jordan Drayer.
Dalia: Yes, yay! And today Jordan is recording, uh, back home in LA.
Jordan: Yes.
Dalia: So she's not in France right now. She's back home in LA, and we are going to talk about all things Jordan, how her experience has been so far, how it's like coming back after spending several months overseas, especially during this interesting time during the pandemic.
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: So I'm excited for you guys to tune in. Yeah. All right. Ready to get this show on the road, Jordan?
Jordan: Let's do some questions.
Dalia: Okay. So how does it feel to be back home? How are you doing? Let's talk about that first.
Jordan: Okay. So it's been three weeks now, and I think that's a good enough time to say I've established a routine. I actually started like with my tutoring students, uh, right away. Like I got back on a Saturday, and I had some students on Sunday. And so that helped.
Dalia: Nice.
Jordan: I was kind of tired for like a week or two. I think I was always going to bed at like 9:00. Like, it was hard to make it through the day with the time, uh, the jet lag, but otherwise it was, it was fairly easy to get back into the routine. And, um, I do like being back with my roommates. I have really good friend roommates. One of them I've known since high school, and the other one's her sister that I'm still getting to learn about a little bit, but it's really nice, because when I was in France, I, I tried to be friends with my roommates, but like, it just takes a lot of time as an adult to make friends. And so like we were getting there, and with time, yeah, like I'm sure I would feel more comfortable, and I, I'm going to keep in touch with those ones, but like nothing beats having like an old friend from high school as a roommate.
Dalia: Yeah. It's like your comfort zone, right?
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: So, well, how has the adjustment been then like emotionally? Like, um, I know you were, you talked about when we had our conversations about the difficulty or challenges you faced when you first went to France and this feeling of like isolation, right? So now that you're back, you're back with your people, you're back in your environment -- and by people, I mean like your friends and stuff, right?
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: So like you're, you're, you're in your bubble again.
Jordan: Yeah. Like, I still don't --
Dalia: Do you feel that you picked up where you left off or does it feel different now?
Jordan: It does sort of feel different. Well, 'cause I don't have a car, so that's one thing. I sold the car before going to France, and I don't know. I don't have, like, 'cause I've only been in LA for like three years now, and I still don't really have that many friends. Like I have, I don't know, acquaintances.
Dalia: Yeah.
Jordan: It's hard to classify someone as a friend for me. Like even though I hang out a lot or might, I trust them, I still feel like something is lacking until a lot of time has passed. So in a way --
Dalia: High bar, high bar. That's good.
Jordan: Well, yeah. I mean, I don't know, like that's my fault.
Dalia: No, it's not a fault. You just know what you want.
Jordan: But I just -- I mean, I've, I've learned that it's a twin thing to expect more from people. Um...
Dalia: Tell me more about that.
Jordan: Just that --
Dalia: As a twin, tell me more about that.
Jordan: -- that you want, because you're used to having a really close relationship from the get-go, from the beginning of life, that when someone else doesn't understand you right away, or, um, I don't know, that they even like the same things or they understand why you don't like this thing, your having to explain it can be difficult sometimes. It's like, wait, why don't you understand I don't like Brussels sprouts? Or something like this.
Dalia: It's like that --
Jordan: Have you ever had that?
Dalia: Yeah. It's that whole discovery phase with new people. It's like dating, you know, you gotta, uh, disco-, even with new friends, you got to learn about them. And that takes time.
Jordan: Yeah. That's, that's, yeah. The time thing is --
Dalia: We've had that luxury our whole life.
Jordan: Yeah. And so the time thing sometimes gets me. I'm like, why, why do we, why do I not feel comfortable with you yet? What's missing? And maybe --
Dalia: Well, I'm curious -- oh, sorry, go on. Yeah.
Jordan: I was gonna say like, maybe like singleton people feel fine with, with one, one hour, one encounter. I don't know. But for me, I, I need more.
Dalia: Um, well the roommates that you live with now, the ones that are your friends for a long time, are they your sister's friends as well? Or are they your own friends?
Jordan: No. This one, this --
Dalia: Did you make these friends together with your sister, and they just came and moved out with you? Or are these your friends?
Jordan: This is actually -- because we did have a lot of friends in common, like in elementary school, but this girl is really my friend, 'cause she's -- we didn't go to the same school. We met in community orchestra. Uh, and then we went to the same college, and I didn't go to college with my twin. So like, she really is my friend --
Dalia: Ah okay, yeah.
Jordan: -- and my sister doesn't have that many memories or I don't know interactions with her even. And then the other one is her sister that I didn't really know before two years ago. So that helps, I think.
Dalia: And does that make you guys feel weird, isolated from each other in any way, if you have separate friends?
Jordan: It did in college. Like when my, my sister would always talk about this one girl, I would get kind of jealous. It's like stop talking about her. Like, 'cause I don't, I don't know her, so I can't trust her. And, but now that girl is my friend too. And she lives in south Florida, but like --
Dalia: Everything always comes full circle with twins.
Jordan: Yeah. Did you ever feel that way? Like, like --
Dalia: Absolutely.
Jordan: -- jealous of friends of your -- 'cause you went to different colleges too, right?
Dalia: No.
Jordan: Oh, no.
Dalia: We had, um, we pretty much, we have pretty much done everything together. You know, up until this point, we went to the same schools. We've been roommates. Um, we still, you know, live together, you know, because neither of us are in a serious relationship, you know, that's gone to that level where we need to move out. And so, I mean, it just makes sense. And I know some people think it's weird, but it's really not with twins.
Jordan: No.
Dalia: You know what I mean?
Jordan: It's totally normal to sleep together.
Dalia: And I don't know how to explain to people. Um, well, well we don't sleep together. We have our own rooms and stuff, but like we have, um, as we share a house, we share everything, you know what I mean? And um, it's, I'm like, you know, my sister is in a similar place to me in her life right now. And we love spending time together. Why would we need to live apart just to prove it to other people that we can? Like, it doesn't like for us, we don't feel like we need to prove anything to anyone. You know what I mean?
Jordan: That's nice, yeah.
Dalia: And, um, you know, of course there's going to come a point where I'm going to branch off and uh, you know, I hope that, as an adult, I'm able to deal with that much more than when we were younger. Because when we were younger, I had the similar experiences that you just described. Uh, if I had a friend that my sister wasn't friends with, you know, there was that weird tension between us because like, I'd want to go out with my friends, and she wasn't really part of that --
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: -- or vice versa, you know?
Jordan: Then it's like, you, you feel --
Dalia: Definitely made us feel left out.
Jordan: You feel sullen somehow. Like, you're, you --
Dalia: Yes!
Jordan: -- if you do go out with your sister's friends, you're like, well, I don't like these people. I don't know them.
Dalia: Yeah! You know, I think of, um, what's the character's name from, uh, Inside Out.
Jordan: Oh.
Dalia: Sadness, or, you know, the blue character. I don't know why I'm --
Jordan: That's Sadness, that's Sadness, yeah.
Dalia: Sadness. Like, you know, "I don't want to do this. I don't want to do that."
Jordan: Yeah, I know, because you don't know them. Like, I felt like that. But then yeah, they became my friends too, uh, and I'm sure that --
Dalia: Yeah, that's what, that's what ended up happening to us. They became, we became friends with each other's friends. So...
Jordan: But so yeah, like that anyway, like I was making friends in France, and uh, coming back to Los Angeles, I'm coming back to a few friends, but I'm -- I still don't have that many friends get one. That's getting us back to where we were.
Dalia: Yeah. No, but yeah. So I mean, okay. So the reason I was asking you that, the whole reason why I was going there, it was because, I mean, you made friends with those people on your own, so clearly you're able to do it. You know what I mean?
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: I think that so like, you'll be able to do it again. I think that's where I was just going with that. So, I mean, you did it without your sister.
Jordan: Oh yeah. Like, yeah. I know. I have grown in confidence as far as making the friends. It's just that the, like the time required so that they become friends instead of acquaintances --
Dalia: Yeah
Jordan: -- it's the thing. But other than that, like I do find myself missing some of the stuff like the cheese and, um, I, I was -- because French people have cheese as dessert and --
Dalia: Oh, okay.
Jordan: Because it's like, you have the meal, and then you have cheese at the end and fruit or whatever dessert. And, uh, they don't, they just don't have like the kinds of cheeses here that, that, uh, they do in France, like camembert and these other things.
Dalia: And cheese is very important.
Jordan: I mean, you can find them, but they're expensive. They're more expensive. And then the bread too. And I miss being able to walk to the ocean, 'cause my little town on the ocean. Uh...
Dalia: Well, oh, you don't, you don't live in anywhere near the water in LA?
Jordan: I do, but it would take a car. Like, if I was to walk --
Dalia: Oh, got it.
Jordan: -- it would take like, I don't know how many hours, but it's like 30 minutes by car.
Dalia: Yeah. I guess I forget not everybody on the west coast lives right by the beach.
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: That's just T -- that's TV for ya.
Jordan: Oh yeah, exactly. No, yeah. It requires a car and like --
Dalia: So are you excited to go back?
Jordan: Yeah, I know. It's so weird, 'cause I keep debating. I'm like, do I want to go back? Now, this is so comfortable. I don't want to leave my roommates here again, but also it's like, yeah, I want to try it. I keep thinking that if I don't do it, I'm, I'm losing out on some challenge and like that, that I would be giving up in some way. And so --
Dalia: You know, I don't know if our listeners, who, like, if they just tuning in, they might not know is why are you in France? Can you explain why...?
Jordan: Well, yeah. Oh yeah. So I never, we never really talked about this. I was in France doing the TAPIF program, which is, um, something that you can do with any Bachelor's and like a good level of French. And you can do it until you're 36 -- 32.
Dalia: Oh, there's an age limit. Okay.
Jordan: Or is it -- no, it's, it is 36. There's a, there's a Japanese program that I think is until 32. Uh, and so like I applied to out of college, and I didn't get it. And um, I was so depressed, and then I went to New Zealand in 2019, and I heard other tourists speaking French. And I was like, oh, I just miss French. And I want to try again and why not? And so I did, and I first was on the wait list, and then I was taken off the wait list. And I think the virus helped with that. People not wanting to go.
Dalia: Timing is everything, Jordan.
Jordan: Yeah. So it was a teaching English abroad program.
Dalia: Nice.
Jordan: And yeah, with the virus even, I was able to see lots of different stuff. I got out to different French cities and little villages and uh, yeah, there was a curfew. Um, at, like, first it was like 6:00 at night. You couldn't do anything. And then they moved it back to 7:00. Um, so generous. And I think currently right now they still have one at 9:00.
Dalia: Oh, okay.
Jordan: And when, when I left, you weren't allowed to travel between regions, but it had been opened before that. But so I was --
Dalia: It seems like it's opening up now, like by the summertime, right?
Jordan: Yeah, they're hoping to start vaccining people in June. Like, they're not, I dunno, they've had a lot of regulations and fear about the vaccine more than we did in America.
Dalia: Huh, Okay, so, um, so let's backtrack a little bit. So are you, um, now just debating whether you actually want to go and pursue your Master's and continue with this program?
Jordan: Yeah, it's that. Because I, I I've already seen like the return of investment basically like in my marketing for like towards French companies saying like I'm an English voiceover, if you ever need English, um, or like an American-accented French. And I've gotten responses more than I get responses from like my email marketing here. And so that seems to be a good thing. Uh, 'cause I still want to be able to do voiceover in the future, but I don't know, just the, the comfort feeling I think of, ah, it's so nice to be with my roommates here. It will be hard to leave them again. But then once I was there, it was fun, and everything was -- even going to the supermarket was an adventure. And there's so many reasons that I do want to go. And I, I have looked at a big picture, like travel, healthcare, uh, vacations that teachers get, all the different benefits and stuff.
Dalia: New people, different culture.
Jordan: Yeah, that too.
Dalia: Different food.
Jordan: Different people, different food. I can still come back to America if I need to. And yeah, like I think I'm still on the side of going for the Master's, but like now that I'm here, I'm being lazy about it. That's all.
Dalia: Yeah. And you know, and that's normal, I think. I mean, it's, it was such a big adjustment to go to begin with. 'Cause I don't, I don't think, uh, correct me if I'm wrong, you haven't lived abroad for that period of time before, right?
Jordan: No.
Dalia: Like this is your first experience moving...?
Jordan: I did like one month, like I did a study abroad program in 2012 for one month in Paris.
Dalia: Yeah.
Jordan: But so this was the longest, like seven months in a little town, like on the coast.
Dalia: Well, I mean, I just think that what you did was brave. It took, it took courage. You know, first of all, okay, yeah. The pandemic, you went even during a pandemic, you know what I mean? But the fact that you were willing to go out of your comfort zone to try something new, I know that a lot of people, and I think a lot of our listeners would probably agree, that's not easy to do to leave what you know, you know what I mean? That being said, now that you're back home, comfortable, debating your future life choices, what is your takeaway for our listeners about your whole experience, and what you see yourself doing maybe down the road, like towards the rest of the year or in the future, because of this experience?
Jordan: I think the takeaway is people are people wherever you go. Like yeah, you have to learn another language sometimes to, to see that. But everyone feels the same things, and they, they have fun trying out new foods, and there's different foods. In the town, even my little town had like an Indian restaurant, a Chinese restaurant. So people always will be the same, like enjoying and exploring, exploring, and liking music and liking beer or, uh, I don't know, learning the same subjects in school, just like the takeaway that I always get from my travel.
Dalia: Is it underneath it, people are the same? Is that what you're saying?
Jordan: Exactly.
Dalia: We're all the same.
Jordan: Like society, societies can say different things, like in this society being late is acceptable. In this society, you're never late.
Dalia: Yeah.
Jordan: So that's the only thing that changes. But all the humans, individual humans are the same. It's just, if society tells us that we can cry or not cry in public, if we can kiss or not kiss --
Dalia: Yeah.
Jordan: Or even --
Dalia: The community rules change, but deep down --
Jordan: Yeah, or society.
Dalia: -- we're the same, yeah. Um, that's interesting. I actually agree with that. And we're going to talk about that a little bit more in another episode, society's rules and how you fit in or feel like you don't fit in. So that's like the perfect, uh, cap to this episode and what we will discuss in a future episode. Awesome.
Jordan: Good job.
Dalia: Is there any last thoughts that you have, um, for everybody before we go?
Jordan: Yeah. That I would do it again. And I hope that, I really hope and wish that there was some kind of program or money by like every government or at least the US government to make kids go abroad. Like that -- because apparently only 10% of Americans have a passport. They feel like, well, America is such a big country. I don't have to go anywhere else. And like, that's true. There's lots of beautiful things to see here, but the culture kind of remains the same, and yeah, you can argue for differences between south and north and west and midwest, but it's definitely good!
Dalia: It's still a level of comfort because there's familiarity --
Jordan: Yeah.
Dalia: -- within our own borders. Yeah.
Jordan: There's the same restaurants for the most part and whatever. So like get out and travel and be open-minded and don't be the American, when you're traveling, who tries to make everything American. Just, okay.
Dalia: Go with the flow.
Jordan: So in France, like, like yeah, go with the flow. Like in France, the salad comes after the main meal, which -- and not before, which is odd. Well, it was odd to me in the beginning, and then I got used to it. I ate like they did, 'cause you like from the, the cafeteria, like you get the, like there's a sort of appetizer, and then the main meal, and then you have the salad, which also the cafeteria at the school was amazing. So yeah, don't --
Dalia: Probably it's because they don't consider pizza a vegetable over there.
Jordan: Yeah. And, uh, hamburgers and French -- well, we did have French fries sometimes, but yeah. Don't -- just go try new things, go travel somewhere for more than one week, if you can. Like, I know it's difficult and it costs money and stuff, but like save up for something.
Dalia: Yeah. Make it a, make it an adventure and really soak it up.
Jordan: And do the free --
Dalia: Awesome.
Jordan: -- or like the reduced stuff. Like I do Airbnb wherever I can, or like try to find friends of family and stuff like that.
Dalia: Yeah. Like I know some friends that used to stay at hostels.
Jordan: Yeah. I've done that too.
Dalia: Um, that's an option. Go for it. I think like you said, Jordan, that's perfect. That's a, that's really like the perfect message. Go try something different, expose yourself to different cultures and just go with the flow.
Jordan: And don't, don't -- also don't be grossed out by like, oh, those are silkworms? I'm not going to eat that. Just try one! The, I dunno, just try one and, or a grasshopper --
Dalia: Or keep an open mind, if other people try it and just be like, okay, it is what it is, whatever.
Jordan: Yeah. I mean, I guess I could even try bungee jump -- I would be really afraid to do that, but if everyone was doing it, maybe I might do it if all I -- if all my friends were going.
Dalia: I mean, speaking of bungee jumping and just really quickly, I had an opportunity to go sky diving when I was in San Diego and I'm like -- you'll be in a group. 'Cause it was like a, it was a group of us. And of course you don't skydive by yourself when it's your first time. You go with like a pro or whatever. I just couldn't, I still couldn't get my, uh, courage to go do it, even with that group. But you know what? Those are the kinds of things that we can just expose ourselves to and --
Jordan: Yeah, you tried.
Dalia: -- push ourselves if we really want it. Yeah. And we can keep trying.
Jordan: Yeah, you can keep trying. You can try to jump off the cliff one day.
Dalia: Safely! With a rope!
Jordan: Well, yeah.
Dalia: And a bungee!
Jordan: And a trained professional, but so yes, thank you, thank you. Dalia, thank you for your interest and --
Dalia: Yeah!
Jordan: Bringing this, um, idea to me. And so yeah. Thank you for listening as well, everybody.
Dalia: I know. I hope you guys enjoyed it. Thank you, Jordan. I really appreciate your thoughts and we can't wait to see you guys next time.
Jordan: Yes.
Dalia: Oh, talk to you guys. Whatever. So you can hear us, you know.
Jordan: Yes.
Dalia: Anyway.
Jordan: Yes. They will see us in their minds.
Dalia: Yeah. Ooh. Yeah.
Jordan: Okay!
Dalia: All right, guys.
Jordan: Thank you!
Dalia: Bye.
Jordan: Bye.
Victor: That's our show. Didn't get enough of the twins? Go to BloomingVoices.com for more information and let us know what you thought of the episode. Twitter, Instagram, email, we've got the works. We'll see you next Wednesday.
